Friendzoned - the big overview |
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Dec 29, 2011 - 11:53 AM - by Jessie James
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How to get friendzoned:
Simply put, you will most likely be friendzoned by women if you don't ask for their phone number when you meet them, and tell them you will call them, and then leave!
You should also then wait 4-6 days to call her, and then ask her on a date.
If you stick around and chat, text her, call her, but don't ask her to go on a date within about 1-2 weeks of meeting her, you are friendzoning yourself!
This is ESPECIALLY true if you spend more than about 5-15 minutes texting/calling/talking to her BEFORE you go on a date.
That is the whole point OF the date, to talk to her and get to know her!
If you've known a woman for weeks, months, or years and have a crush on her ... you never asked her out, did you? That's friendzone.
You MUST ask a woman out on a date from the BEGINNING to know what is going on. Every day you wait is a day you are friendzoning yourself by not making a move like a mature adult male would do.
Every minute you spend texting a woman, talking to her on the phone, or "hanging out" and not making a move is a minute that you are telling her that you DON'T like her because she is too fat, ugly, stupid, shallow, or that you're gay, immature, or lack confidence and are a bad partner.
The whole point of asking a woman out on a date is to determine if there is a sexual (adult, mature) connection AND a friend connection. If you don't make a move that shows you are sexually attracted to her, like an adult, you automatically are saying you do not like her.
That is why you MUST ask her on a date and make a move on her!
Ok, so here's what you need to do!
Asking her out is simple. Your plan should be to take her someplace that is somewhat nice, but also quiet. You want to take her someplace that gives her a reason to get dressed up (to show how important you are to her, and how much she is interested in you) but also where the focus is you and her. You want a nice quiet bar or restaurant where you can sit alone.
When you ask her on the first or second date, you need to have a simple plan. You should take her to a low entertainment value date, and I recommend drinks (but not coffee, smelly tuna breath is a bad move...) so that you can keep the date under $20.00. This is VERY important to keep it cheap and intimate.
If you invite a woman out on a date that is on the following list, or similar to it, you also risk getting used because she may see you as a sucker with money, or because she simply has nothing better to do (or her other date bailed on her!), as these dates often involve very little interaction between you and her:
- Movie (Horrible date!)
- Lunch
- Dinner
- Party
- Dance club
- Boating
- Ski trip
- Go carting
- Opera/play
The whole point of your first date should be to sit and talk to her and get to know her and what she would like to do. You should be able to determine what you have in common. (How?) If you suggest a date where YOU are the whole reason to go, women who are only using you won't want to go out because they know they will be stuck with you. However a woman who DOES like you will GLADLY spend time with you ...that's what she wants!
Why do you think so many women say a romantic walk on a beach sounds like fun? It's so they can get to know YOU without any distractions!
You should also know when you are going to go out. You know, HAVE A PLAN!
Therefore, here is a sample way to ask her out:
"Hey Samantha, let's go on a date*, Thursday at 8:00, to Mikes Bar and grille, we'll have a drink or two. What do you say?"
Then you shut up and listen to her answer.
She will give you one of three responses:
1. "Yes, I'd love to go!"
This is good. Say thanks and get off the phone.
2. "Yes, I'd love to go, but I work until 8:00. Can we meet at 9:00?"
This is good IF she COUNTER-OFFERS a different time or day only. However, if she counters with a different venue, that is bad. (For example, if she takes charge and tells you she wants to see a high-entertainment-value venue, like dinner or a movie, tell her you don't have time for that and the original offer stands, or you can't make it.)
3. "Yes, I'd love to go, but [ANY EXCUSE HERE]."
This is bad. This is her telling you "No". You tell her that's too bad, maybe some other time, talk to her for another minute, then hang up and toss her number. Excuses she may come up with can be ANYTHING, but I've heard things like "I have to work late", "I have to study", "My sister is coming in that night", "I have to get up early for work the next day", "I have a boyfriend" (which may be a lie), or any number of other things.
Even worse if she says she wants to "think about it" or "maybe" and asks you to "call me back later [typicall the night of the date, last fucking minute...] and I'll let you know." This is her way of saying "I'm going to see if any other guys ask me out, and if not then I will go with you. You are my last resort." Tell her to confirm now or you can't make it. Don't let her make you sit around until the last second. If you do that, you are desperate and she knows it. Tell her to decide now or you'll make other plans.
*NOTE: You SHOULD use the word "date" when you ask her out. This makes your intentions clear. If you do NOT use the word "date", or - worse - ask her to "hang out" then you are friendzoning yourself - and lying to her (because you do want to do out, but if you don't make it clear then you're trying to trick her. Don't be that guy!)
NOTE: I recommend alcoholic drinks because they help relax you, and if a woman is willing to drink with you that also says "I know alcohol often leads to lowered inhibitions, which may lead to making out or sex, and that is OK with this guy." A woman who doesn't want to risk intimacy probably won't want to have drink with you either. However, don't have more than 2 drinks - and don't get drunk.
So if you got a go ahead, go on your date. Get to know her without interrogating her. You should be asking her questions and finding out what you have in common. You know, if she is into movies and music that you like, and so forth.
However, as a general rule, you want to AVOID topics such as the following:
- SEX! (This is the NUMBER ONE TURNOFF for most women!)
- Cars
- Computers
- The weather (if you talk about the weather, consider the date finished!)
- Crime
- Politics
- Religion
- Death
- Diesease
- War
- The apocolypse
- Child molesters
- OTHER WOMEN (nearby, exs, or female friends) except to briefly mention your wonderful mother
- Your job AND you describe it as crappy, frustrating, or boring. It is, of course, good to be employed!
- STDs
- Star Wars
- Facebook
- Video games
- Your lack of luck with ladies
- Lack of money/being broke
- Depression or other personal problems
- Etc...
The whole point of the date is to have a GOOD time, put yourself in a GOOD light, and get to know what GOOD things you have in common.
LISTEN CAREFULLY to what your date says. Most people will give you hints about themselves. if she says she moved from Colorado to the Maine, ask her why - was it for school or work? And does she like it out here, other than the fact that she met you? 
PRO TIP: Jokingly put yourself in a good light when possible.
PRO TIP: Never be serious. Tease, flirt, and joke with her. For example, if she asks what you do for a living, tell her you are a rocket surgeon.
What is the point of dating?
The most important point of dating is to screen out women who are NOT a good match.
Sure, everyone has good traits, and I am sure most women you meet will too. But you need to have a list of traits that are deal breakers for you, and find out on the first few dates if she is going to be a bad match for you. For example, you might have a list that looks like this:
- Has a boyfriend, or a VERY recent ex-BF (major deal breaker!)
- Has a clinical medical issue, or is not clinically sane (major deal breaker!)
- Talks about other men frequently (major deal breaker!)
- Flirts/dances with other men in front of you (major deal breaker!)
- Smoker
- Drug user
- Has legal problems (criminal or civil)
- Tries to pay for the date (sign of disinterest)
- Is unattractive to you, or lied about herself via profile (if you met her online)
- Has financial problems (major debt, spendthrift)
- Bad breath or body odor
- Is rude to the waiter or waitress (she'll be rude to you, just wait)
- Lives more than 15-30 minutes away (tip: long distance relationships are a bad thing)
- Has unprotected sex and then claims you got her pregnant (tip: ask for a peternity test)
- Is boring or disinterested, no connection to you
- Refuses your advances (sign of disinterest)
- Prefers to communicate via text/phone/IM (sign of disinterest)
- Will never come to you, instead you must always pick her up or take her out (sign of using you)
- Refuses to go out with you unless you are spending money on her or the event (gold digger)
- Asks what kind of car you drive, and she thinks it matters (gold digger)
- Lives with her BF, her ex, or perhaps her parents and has never lived alone (subjective depending on her age of course)
- Something else you can't stand or don't want
The point here is that you MUST have standards and you MUST know a bad woman when you meet one. You need to find out what BAD things she has going for her sooner or later, at least by the third to fifth date (or so).
The whole point of dating is to DISQUALIFY BAD WOMEN, not be accepting of ANY woman you meet who likes you.
At the end of the date, which should be no longer than about 30 minutes to an hour (leave her so she is wanting more dates with you!), if everything went good then go for a goodnight kiss. If you don't, you are signalling that you don't find her attractive enough to make a move on her.
If not, call her and ask her on a date again in 2-4 days. Follow the 1-2-3 rule above and you will now know if she is into you or not.
From there, you will know if you are friendzoned or not.
Pretty simple, huh? Is there anything more I need to know?
YES!
Check out the Friendzoned forums!
There are also a few resources which I found helpful, such as...
1. DocLove - buy his "Dating Dictionary" AKA "The System". You need this book. If you read this book, you will never talk to loser women again.
His advice column is here, but it won't make much sense without his eBook. His key points can be found here and I will summarize here the most important advice I think you need. There are three (major) Male Traits the female responds to positively. You must have them, if the female is to fall, and stay in love with you.
They are Confidence: made up of Self Confidence and Self Esteem; Control: made up of Discipline, Patience and Self Control; and Challenge -- which no one talks about -- and which makes her chase you. Challenge is one third of what a man has to offer, and the experts have no idea what it is, much less how important it is to a romantic relationship.
The three major Female Trait qualities that men should be aware of and look for in a long term mate are: Integrity, made up of Loyalty, Trust, and Honesty; Giving; and Flexibility.
The maintenance program, which is what you are going to carry out in order to keep her, consists of Respect, Affection, and Romance. Think about these comments and see how they fit into your dating experiences, successes and failures. I bet you will see how the failures are because of those traits not being present, either in you or her!
NOTE: I cannot stress how important that last Doc Love information is - if you read nothing else, read this article!
2. Double Your Dating - buy his ebook. This will teach you how to stop being so passive and needy. It will also teach you how to be much better with women. Be sure to sign up for the email list.
3. The book "No More Mr. Nice Guy" by Dr. GLover (Amazon.com). This book will help teach you to stop being so passive. This is a MUST HAVE BOOK for all single men.
4. SoSuave.com This site has some great articles, especially the Why not Just Be Yourself article which you should read. Be sure to sign up for the email list.
5. Smart guys date in parallel. If you are smart, you will learn to date more than one woman at a time.
6. David Wygant has some great tips and videos at his site.
7. Fast seduction has a great Newbie overview here.
8. Are you coming on too strong? Read this article..
9. Net2Bed and Net2Wed Systems (rar file). This used to be sold, now it appears you can only pirate it (which I don't condone, but ... if it's not for sale...) This will help you change your online dating profile to be more far more effective. Many guys I have recommended it to have tried it and now are fighting the women off.
Also, you should have a profile on OkCupid.com or PlentyOfFish.com, and not match.com or any other pay site. Long story short, the quality of women is better, and the sites are not out to scam you with fake profiles.
What if I need more advice?
The last piece of advice I can give you is to always take advice from men, not women when it comes to dating and relationships. Be wary of who you are getting your advice from. If you ask a guy who is a super model, it's doubtful he really has any advice because he's never had to pick up women and maintain a relationship - the women have done it all (and hence why his relationships are probably volatile and unsuccessful). If you ask a guy who married his high school sweetheart, he won't have any good advice either.
If you ask a woman for advice, when clearly she has never even asked a woman out let alone gone on a successful date with another woman, then she has no relevant advice either. However, if you ask the guy who has gone on dozens of dates, dumped lots of women, and has finally found a great woman, even though he is not rich or good looking, HE will be able to give you good advice because he learned from his experiences and mistakes.
Even without advice from other people, if you go on dates and MAKE MISTAKES you can learn from them too. Just pay attention to when your date starts acting disinterested and then think back about what you may have done, then don't do it again!
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0 Replies | 376 Views
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 Always getting friendzoned? Read this |
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Sep 28, 2008 - 9:39 AM - by Jessie James
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Okay, so now that all is said and done, and you got friendzoned again, now is the time to reflect. Let me suggest some reading materials you should go over so you will be better prepared next time.
1. www.askmen.com/dating/doclove - Doc Love is in my opinion one of the best advice writers for guys who are looking for quality long term relationships. His material really helps you qualify the WOMAN. Too often us guys will go out with any woman, or attempt to, and not have any qualifications for her. I would strongly recommend you start reading his articles. If you have the $100, but his book at www.DocLove.com. If you don't have the $100, save up $100 and buy the book. This book is a must-have for any guy.
2. www.DoubleYourDating.com - You can sign up for his free email newsletter and will receive tons of great articles. I would also recommend you purchase his ebook. It's loaded with great information on flirting and teasing and generally being a guy who is attractive to women. Note that I list this second - that is because the first site teaches you that women are not all perfect. This is important - if you make yourself attractive to women, but attract crappy women, you will suffer greatly.
3. "No more Mr. Nice guy" - Book by Dr. Glover. This is a great book on general leadership for yourself. It teaches you how to be a stand-up kind of guy, who is honest, has self confidence, self respect, and is one who women will find attractive in relationships. This is a great resource to have around and review yearly.
4. "The way of the superior man" - Book by David Deida. This is a fantastic book which has some very high level stuff that can help polish you off. This is something else I recommend all guys have. It gets a little spiritual at the end, but no big deal.
5. The Mystery Method. Pick up his http://www.themysterymethod.com/0/bo...llets-handbook book. This is very valuable information that will help you understand approaching women, asking them out on dates, and seduction techniques. However, I urge you to understand the core philosophy behind this material - it is designed solely to pick up women and have sexual relationships. Yes, that's great, but the thing it totally neglects (and doesn't even understand) is how to qualify a woman, how to be truly attractive, and how to maintain a relationship. MM will result in you having lots of short, sexual relationships but if you find the perfect woman (which you will) she will slip between your fingers like sand. You've been warned! If you don't also have Doc Love and David DeAngelo (Double Your Dating) under your belt, you will come to a wall with women which may be hard to un-learn.
6. Net2bed system. This simple system helps you understand the dynamics of communicating with women via email, Facebook, or dating sites. It has great advice about putting your best foot forward and not looking like a dork. Also well worth the money.
If you buy all those things, you're probably looking at $300. However, if you follow the principles you learn from them, they will pay for themselves by not over-spending on dates, not picking bad women, and not wasting time going in circles.
Sooner or later you'll want to learn that stuff anyway, so I recommend go buy one, complete it, then buy the next one, and so on.
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3 Replies | 969 Views
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Quick "How to" for asking women out, and when to call |
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Sep 28, 2008 - 9:34 AM - by Jessie James
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If you get her number, and call her the next day, you're not likely to have good results.
Read this field study my friend did:
http://www.friendzoned.com/forums/showthread.php?t=533
Now, with that in mind, WHEN you get her number, you're going to tell her "I'll call you and we'll go on a date." DON'T BE LIKE EVERY OTHER LAME FUCKING GUY AND CALL HER THE NEXT FUCKING DAY!  Christ. Have some self-control. She's not going anywhere! Give her a little suspense. Make her think you have a life and she's not the only thing on your mind. Wait 4-6 days, then call her and ask her out on a date.
Now, with that said, where are you going to go? Someone asked me about going to the zoo, and here is what Isaid:
1. How much does the zoo cost? Is it less than $20? First dates should always be CHEAP to weed out gold diggers or chicks who are just bored and looking to use some sucker and his wallet.
2. Is it within about 10 minutes drive time? If the date goes bad, how long do you have to be with her to drive her home (assuming you pick her up).
3. Is it upscale enough that she can dress up and look good for you (an indicator of how much she likes you)? You have to give her an opportunity to look her best.
4. Is it low entertainment value so the only reason why she would want to go would be to talk to you?
5. Is it quiet and secluded so you will not have any distractions, such as other guys checking her out or hitting on her?
6. Does the event focus on YOU and the only thing she really has to do is TALK to you? In other words, is there any reason why she would want to go other than to be with you?
Yeah, the zoo sounds fun ... but not for a first date. You guys have to learn this. A first date is NOT to impress her. It's for YOU to get to know HER and determine if SHE is good enough for YOU, because YOU ARE THE PRIZE. YOU ARE THE REASON WHY SHE WANTS TO GO OUT. If she wants a $100 dinner ... if she wants to go to a movie ... if she wants to go to a concert ... a club, a party, a popular bar ... then it's not a good date.
A woman has to EARN the right to spend your money, she has to EARN the right to be taken some place nice, she has to PROVE she is only into you and doesn't have ulterior motives.
Quick failure story: I neglected these rules and went on a date with a chick to a popular bar. Bought her drinks, danced with her, when I realized she was a regular. All her "guy friends" were "checking me out." I was getting questions from these guys like "Who are you? How'd you meet? She's a good girl, don't fuck up." etc. While they were questioning me, she was off dancing with some other guy. Turns out her ex was there, she ended up going off with him. Lesson learned: I make the plans, I take her where I want to go, and not someplace where we will be interrupted.
You can learn these lessons on your own if you want, but you'll end up like I did - I was 30 years old before I started having quality dates. 
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0 Replies | 718 Views
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